As humans, we tend to see ourselves at the top of a natural hierarchy — the most intelligent and successful species on Earth. What if that conviction isn't just wrong, but also dangerous?

In this episode of our season on planetary diplomacy, we sat down with Christine Webb, a primatologist and Associate Professor at New York University, to help us rethink humanity’s place in the web of life. Christine is the author of The Arrogant Ape: The Myth of Human Exceptionalism and Why it Matters, a scientist’s plea for more humility toward the more-than-human world and an argument for how de-centering humanity could help us better understand not just other species, but ourselves.

In this conversation, we dig into the stubborn myth of human superiority — what it is, why it persists, and what it might take to finally leave it behind.